In 2Do you have the possibility to ‘Backup to Email’ and then ‘Long-tap on the attached file and select Copy to 2Do to restore directly from your device’.
Multiple contexts, or tags, or something similar, is coming to Omnifocus, according to earlier information from The Omni Group. They just needed a new file format allowing such a feature, among others, and that file format was introduced in both Mac and IOS in the version released a few days ago. This has certainly been something missing in Omnifocus.
You know, I actually miss some subjective matters like the look and feel. In objectice measurements OF2 might win. It is the GUI (or haptic if you want) experience that make many people that have switched to 2Do actually “loving” the software.
It has always been the biggest mistake (and clearly the by FAR most avoidable one) to solely compare specs. That is still done with Apple products. Less CPU power, no SD card slot… How come so many people LOVE apple products? It is the feel, the haptic experience, it is the amazing GUI.
2Do is not Apple and OF is not Windows - but I love! 2Do.
The ultimate goal of every serious freelancer and indie developer out there. If they are sincere.
I think the Mac version of Omnifocus looks good and works great. The IOS version could both look and work better, and probably will. As i use the Mac version and IOS version separately, it would be possible for me to use 2Do on Iphone/Ipad only, and I was tempted to do so, because I really liked both the look and the functionality of 2Do. But when I found that features necessary to me were missing, I returned to Omnifocus. More aware of how good Omnifocus actually is, I accepted the fact that no product is perfect, and sent a suggestion for development to The Omni Group instead. My suggestion can be found in an ealier post of mine:
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The iOS version of OmniFocus 2 does have some ways to go to become equal to the Mac version in terms of features. For example, batch editing isn’t possible in the iOS version.
I did like that I could just use the 2Do on my iPad exclusively. But my honeymoon glow faded after 3 weeks and I stayed with OmniFocus 2.
Here is one workflow that I had in OmniFocus but gave me some some friction in 2Do and almost every other task management app. It is the review workflow/perspective.
I used to do the weekly review. At the end of my workweek, I’ll start reviewing every project. This can take up to 2 hours (sometimes more) every week. There would be times I just didn’t feel like burning 2 hours into that process. Then I’d put it off and try to avoid the friction and burden of the weekly review.
In OmniFocus, I don’t need to do the weekly review anymore. I do a daily review. Every project has different review cycles. Most of my someday/maybe (on hold) projects are set to be reviewed once a month. Some active projects are set to be review weekly or bi-weekly. Projects that need more monitoring and/or have constant changes will need a shorter review (every day, every 2 days, or every 3 days).
Not every project needed to be reviewed on a weekly basis. The review became my tickler file. When I wake up in the morning, I’ll see what needs to be reviewed. Some days, I’ll have eight projects to review. Other days, I might have just one project to review. I might even find a few days where I don’t have anything to review. Breaking up the weekly review process into bite-sized chunks enabled me to overcome the idea of needing to review everything in one sitting.
In other task management apps, I’d have to set the Start/Defer date to a future date to remind myself to look at a project. But I got into the habit of just deferring everything to another day on a constant basis.
In 2Do, I had to make a “review” project with a checklist with tasks such as:
Review Office Actions List (every day)
Review Home Actions List (every 3 days)
Review Home Renovations List (Every week)
These tasks would repeat at different intervals as described in the task description.
I was taking a peek once again at the 2Do iOS app and went through the introduction tutorial once again. This highlighted some of the features that are in 2Do.
I do like 2Do’s pinch-to-zoom, batch editing, calendar, drag-and-drop, and password lock. But it wasn’t enough for me to switch over to 2Do.
OmniFocus already has some of 2Do’s features that were highlighted: an inbox, email to OmniFocus, quick entry, groups (folders).
Sorting is something that is possible when using the projects perspective. I guess some folks are asking for manual sorting in custom perspectives. It never really hampered my workflow but I can see how that might be important for other users.
2Do’s smart lists is something I was interested in. I can create different search conditions that are not possible in OmniFocus custom perspectives. But I think I’ve found enough custom perspectives to keep my workflow happy. But I’d still like to see more robust custom perspective view settings in the future.
2Do’s ability to put a task to sleep with tags wasn’t something i was very interested in. I’d just move a task to an"on hold" project to put something to sleep.
2Do’s alarm feature is a nice thing to have that isn’t present yet in OmniFocus.OmniFocus does have notification center alerts but I don’t know if it is quite the same.
I think every task management app will cater to different needs. Apple Reminders might suit someone who doesn’t have a lot of projects and mostly single actions to take care of. Things might appeal to someone who needs to start grouping a bunch of tasks into projects and folders. 2Do will cater to users who are looking for an alternative to OmniFocus.
But for now, I’m pretty much situated in OmniFocus 2. I’d love to see more features. But I think the Omnigroup will eventually get around to making the iOS app feature equivalent to the Mac desktop app. I have been very impressed at how much has been added since the introduction of OmniFocus 2.0 a couple of years ago. My honeymoon with 2Do lasted almost a month. But there wasn’t anything powerful enough for me to move over.
I am eager to see new versions of 2Do in the future. But Omnigroup has been churning out new features on consistent basis and the user forums have been a great boon to help everyone that reads these forums.
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This is a really nice summary and I (having been a OF2 user quite a while) totally admit the pro’s OF2 offer (like the review function). I’m still trying different options to bring 2Do close as possible to such a function. Obviously that function didn’t make me stay with OF, but I totally agree that if would be nice if a comparable function would be included in an update :).
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As the review function is a real winner for OF and it’s missing in 2Do I approached it in a different way. I tried to understand what review is REALLY all about and obviously it’s about a) keeping your taskmanager “clean” and b) check on important tasks more frequently than on not so important tasks.
Well it is impossible to mimic the day by day fine-tuning of OF2 review (i.e. “every 233 days”). This also comes handy if you want to interlace your “review days” to not having to review too many projects/tasks at once.
So my solution for 2Do does not try to “mimic” the OF2 review but I tried to approach from a different angle:
I created three smart lists:
- Review: High Relevance (= highly relevant projects/tasks) (= starred or high priority)
- Review: Medium Relevance (= medium or low priority)
- Review: Low Relevance (= “no prioritiy” AND “no start date” AND “no due date”)
As you can see the low relevance should really only reveal stuff that may be in any list but has no sign of being even somewhat important. You could say that’d be like the “Someday” list - but many tasks still belong in a certain project, so just defining low relevance as tasks in “Someday” wouldn’t work.
This ONLY works if one really uses the “priority” feature of 2Do consequently. That is very different from the “starring” used in OF2 and requires definitely some thinking beforehand (when I clean my inbox - more or less equivalent to what I had to do in OF setting a review time window).
Next and last step: I created a list group “OTHER” and in that group there is a list called “Review”. Within review there are three tasks, one for high relevance, one for medium one for low.
And then I’m actually free to decide which repeat time span I define for those three tasks. Currently, that is 1 week, 2 weeks and 1 month, always timed to Friday afternoon. But of course that can be set to longer intervals as well.
So in summary: the review function in OF2 is brillant and as there is no “native” function for that in 2Do, it can only be an “alternative”. Interesting is also the fact that although I have only quite limited options for review intervals I finally come quite well to terms with it. And the same thing was true for OF2, where I was totally fine with having only ONE “tag” = context. I took it rather as a challenge to narrow a task down to its core and never thought of it as a handicap.
[I forgot to say that the option “Review: Medium Relevance” is complicated and needs some of that script possibilities build into 2Do. It’s sth like type: !starred AND medprio OR !starred AND lowprio OR (!starred AND noprio AND (!nodue OR !nostart)).]
Very interesting discussion!
For me the most important things to stay with OF are:
*) Sync with own WebDAV server
*) Great support of Apple Script and so many shared templates
*) Community
*) Flexible setup that allows to configure OF to your needs through perspectives and Apple Script
*) Great support
And yes, I like the interface of 2Do on iOS devices as well. It’s very user friendly and intuitive. I hope OF is integrating some of the features in their next versions or in OF3.
The community is maybe for me the biggest plus for Omnifocus.
I mean, is there even any forum/mailinglist/usergroup for 2Do? I haven’t been able to find it!
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It’s mostly Twitter that you will find the 2Do developer on.
@2doapp
But it’s kinda hard to have a discussion in 140 characters or less.
Mhm there is sth like a Knowledge Base for FAQs, and of course the Twitter feed(s), but no real “forum”. That indeed doesn’t exist for 2Do. And sometimes I would love to have that. The interpretation of the fact that there’s no forum could be funny, though. Is it that the OmniGroup nourishes forum culture? (good thing! and I believe they do - I guess it’s hosted on their servers). And they have a couple of people more than the 2Do developer(s) :).
Does it mean that 2Do causes less problems, thus less questions, thus no forum needed? Well, who knows. I certainly find forums ALWAYS interesting, as long as the “good rules” are followed and nobody gets verbally attacked or sth.
But there is one thing that kind of really makes me wonder: when it’s about the pro’s of OF… the posts are facts that are in like 90% of the cases about what’s "outside" of OF, not really about the core functions. If it actually comes down to core functions there are some very few unique functions - as every software has (okay, not all) - and so it all comes down to personal preference.
I just find it weird that OF users talk so much about “syncing” (= about connectivity), “great support of Apple Script” (= about programming), “community”, again… “great support” and again… “community”. I’m not saying that to mock, as I said, I was a totally satisfied OF user. But I can’t help to think that the software itself isn’t optimally build if users talk mostly about stuff that is NOT build in the core software of OF.
I’m not sure I understand why, Eneas, you stay with OF because of
- syncing (2Do offers dropbox, iCloud, WebDAV - well, you could play the “data manipulation” card, but who says and especially who KNOWS if the server that OF uses is more secure than dropbox)
- Community - that IS great to have, especially as I needed more than 4 weeks to get into OF2 quite well, and I needed 1 week for 2Do - mastering 90% of its potential (which is around 90% of the OF2 potential)
- Flexible setup (lots about that in 2Do, too) and perspectives! (perspectives are smart lists in 2Do and as outlined from someone else those smart lists can actually be “programmed” in a more complex way than OF2 perspectives, not even speaking about the multiple tags.
I’m not a security expert but I thought there was a forum thread that discussed security issues and the new encryption scheme with an own invitation for input and ideas on how to improve security.
If you’re a WebDAV savvy user, I guess you might be able to make heads or tails out of it.
Sometimes the discussions here not only about the features but also how task managers fit into the grand scheme of things. For example, most task managers aren’t very good as a note manager. We would talk about Evernote or some equivalent softwAre package. We would talk about higher levels of thinking with goals, life plans, and such. Something like a Kanban board or mind map would be more appropriate and is discussed here.
In this day and age, if an app has AppleScript support, it stands a better chance of becoming a major part of a person’s workflow, I couldn’t imagine Adobe indesign or photoshop without AppleScript support.
maybe my journey with OmniFocus was different. I started GTD at about the same time I started using OmniFocus. In David Allen’s book, he mentioned that it takes at least 2 years to finally master and get a grip on GTD. I think that my experience matches that statement. Most of my time in OmniFocus was trying to play with different workflows. I had more difficulty trying to implement a GTD system before I could even use OmniFocus.
Adding parts that worked for me (review, capturing, organizing are some examples) and subtracting parts that didn’t work as well for me (energy as a context as another example) was an experience that had me flabbergasted. It took time to develop and settle on a workflow that worked for me. When I tried 2Do, I had a better grip of my personal workflow. I already had the groundwork and foundation already set. It was just a matter of trying to figure out how to implement it inside 2do. So I didn’t have to play as much with 2Do.
That makes total sense. I’m also working with other software for needs like data management (Evernote) or team management (OmniPlan) or even mind maps. If it “clicks” it clicks. And as long as we find the right softwares to feel better in a highly complex life everything’s fine, indeed!
Maybe the community does not discuss core features so much is because they are mature, proven and work. As much as 2do on an iPad is a great example of good UI Design it just does not match up to OF in nearly every way when it comes to working with it.
I think if your needs are 'average to modest" either will do the job and do it well, but when it comes to applying real stress testing OF will win hands down. Each has a market, and both compete for the middle ground, move up a notch and really there is no competition. Thats fine 2do is what it is, a good reasonably priced piece of software that does what it does well. OF on the other hand is the pro version, and for high end usage I genuinely believe it is unbeatable, so maybe the comparisons between the two are not really valid at all.
To give an analogy maybe OF is to 2do what devonthink is to Evernote.
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Have you ever tried to answer the question what core functions a software, eg. Omnifocus, needs to have that leads to a big community, forum discussions and shared templates etc.? What needs does this users have?
In my case I want to setup OF in such a way that my daily/weekly planning workflow and the review is as smooth as possible (without any friction).
For example: Via AppleScript and the use of KeyboardMaestro I have created a unique keyboard shortcut which guides me through my daily planning process.
Pressing the shortcut, opens the daily planning perspective. After finishing the first task, the same shortcut completes the task within OF. Some notes of a task contain a url (to a certain perspective, or an individual file, or the calendar app, etc.). When such a task is available, I press the same shortcut once again: the task is completed automatically within OF and the link within the note is opened automatically. When I have done the work within the perspective guess which shortcut brings me back to my daily planning perspective? Yes, you are right it’s the same shortcut again. No friction at all. I can focus completely on the things I really want to do. And I have a lot of other examples within other workflows.
Of course not everyone has the same needs that I have, and for some this is a complete overkill. I’m fine with OF. With 2Do I couldn’t implement those smooth workflows.
What I above meant with “syncing” is that I can have my own WebDAV server and sync with my own server. I have control over my data and doesn’t have to use any commercial cloud server. Please correct me if I’m wrong but I think this is not possible with 2Do.
OF is not perfect. I’m missing features such as more individual perspectives (smart searches) or a better UX in their iOS apps. However, some features such as multiple tags (and hopefully more custom perspectives) are coming in the next while.
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Whoo, nothing wrong with my thought processes (I hope), just expressing my opinions so no need to get personal.
Actually nothing wrong with comparing DevonThink to Evernote, both information managers, both useable by many but DT is in a different league when it comes to retrieval and referencing. One acid test, if an application is scriptable it is usually better technically than one that isn’t. No I have not used 2do for a year in a stress test scenario, I just felt it was not for me for the reasons stated previously and dropped it. However I genuinely believe OF is the top of the tree and justifiably so, it is simply a professionals piece of kit as is photoshop, sublime text etc etc.
Its back to the 80/20 rule, 80% of people will never get the most out of OF, but the 20%, they are the ones for whom OF really is the only choice.
Caveat, these are opinions are all mine and made with and in a sound mind
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I actually think /"have read that you can use your very own CalDAV server with 2Do, so yes.
I think personally will leave it at that and Im excited what the future will bring. Didnt want to get personal, I apologize for that. Great forum and great people, constructive, calm. I am really impressed and I mean it.
Maybe someone of you can me help to create a 2Do forum :)? Ha just kidding, althogh Id love that.
And I didnt find any REAL good video trainings for 2Do (not the youtube crap), like for Adobe products, LOVED their trainings…
Have a great evening, guys!!
Michael
The “bandwagon” hit me as well. I am not really sure why since I am quite happy with Omnifocus but I tried 2Do. I read all the good blog posts about it and just wanted to like it. It’s been a couple of days and I still kind of hate using it. Let me try to collect some thoughts:
Setup
My setup as a Omnifocus user is like this:
- Lists are “Projects” or “Areas of Responsibility” like “Work”, “Tech”, “Drivers License” and so on
- Smart Lists are Perspectives to collect all the things I need together
- Tags are Contexts
Organizing
Projects and Subprojects work fine. Tags as well. But Perspectives I miss a lot. Mainly I want to say aggregate me all tasks with tag x, y and z but only show the first available tasks from the subprojects. That doesn’t seem to be possible.
The documentation is horrible and mainly goes into detail for the iOS versions (which seem to be the main focus). Can I include a list into a smart search? After a lot of searching I still don’t know.
Then the first available thing. That’s a biggie. Omnifocus protects me clean from the massive workload a project can have and only shows stuff that I can actually do.
In 2Do, I see all subtasks of all projects that match the search. I have a lot of projects at work, and all of them are tagged with “Office” or “Computer”. When I am in my “2Do perspective” (= smart list), it is just too overwhelming to even continue using it.
Shortcuts
I like the really obvious shortcuts 2Do has. j to jump (although quick jump to tags is not possible?), . to push the start date / defer date back a day, it’s all great.
But adding tasks is horrible. I hit my global shortcut, type in a title, hit tab and it jumps to the project/list. Now I have to hit enter, it opens a dropdown list with the first level of my lists. Typing a few letters actually lets you jump down to the right list but this doesn’t work for nested ones.
So I have to write “Work”, then take my right hand off the keyboard to go to the arrow keys, hit “->”, then continue with selecting the project. Give me a fuzzy selector.
And what if the project doesn’t exist yet? I can’t create it from the add window.
The date picker is a mess and close to impossible to navigate with keyboard only. It took me a while to realize that I can also write the date directly in the field and just ignore the picker.
I do like the addition of Edit Dates/Notes/Tags/Recurrence/etc… shortcuts a lot.
Sync
I am very biased here. I don’t like Dropbox and would prefer Drive / iCloud (not Reminders)
Final
I don’t know. I do like 2Do and believe that the active developer behind it will polish it up in no time.
I can ignore the quick add for now and just stuff everything into the inbox but I need the option to limit visible tasks by “first available”.
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Well, yes perspectives are smart lists in 2do and they are more powerful than perspectives in OF2. Not only by combination, also due the facts that you have multiple tags, sth only Omni knows why still clinging to ONE (yes, sth about compatibility, well the world spins fast guys).
If you feel overwhelmed why dont you pause some tags, goes within seconds in 2Do. You can star taks you want to work first on or create a smartlist for that.
You,have to do some thinking, but then everything makes sense again.
Also a (not THE) review function can be implemented in 2Do. Again, little bit of thinking AND personal preference. See one of my posts above. Im not missing the day exact option in OF2.
But I love the smartlists, way more powerful than perspectives. Perspectives for which you have to actually pay quite some money on TOP of the app as if it would be sth so great (for iOS AND macOS!). Doesnt that leave you,at,all a little puzzled? It is a total standard feature and the iOS version of OF2 is … preposterous.
2Do: A full tagging system. Fantastic layout, look and feel on iOS unmet, on macOS at least the same looks, so you feel right at home.
Password protect tasks, lists or projects or everything!.
Pinch to zoom…
Integration to Airmail, Fantastical…Evernote.
Well, yes. You have already mentioned above that 2Do fits your needs.
When you doesn’t look into details, 2Do is a great app. But when you want to implement the workflows that the other users love in OF you get stucked in 2Do.
For example, you have mentioned that a sync on your own CalDAV server is possible. You are right but there are several drawbacks syncing with CalDAV such as the “minor” detail that a full sync between several 2Do apps is not possible: http://www.2doapp.com/kb/article/which-sync-method-should-i-use.html
When you read the other posts above in detail you find a lot of other more use cases where OF is superior against 2Do. I can see the point that multiple tags and the iOS design are great in 2Do, but as long as the other features/workflows (AppleScript support, individual review configuration etc.) of OF are not realizable in 2Do, I will definetly stay with OF.
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