I have no expectation OF1 will be updated beyond a short time period after the release of OF2. I have only been posting here because the use of a right-hand checkbox in combination with its new role in OF2 is one of my primary reasons I find OF2 difficult to use. With all of the hoopla over the “improved interface” my concerns are drowned out and I am exploring my options in investigating other tools to attempt to maintain the productivity I have come to expect from OF1. Continued use of OF1 is not an option as this solution would be short lived.
If I may ask you a further question:
If the interface is causing you frustration will you continue to use such software if these items are not addressed? This is what I am preparing for, if aspects of the software are not addressed I see no reason for my upgrade. I have been using OF1 since about 2008 (if I recall correctly) and it might be time to move to another option.
I highly doubt OmniFocus 1 will be updated at all in the near future. As said, if compatibility issues arise on OS X 11/10.11, then their default option would be to tell us to upgrade to OmniFocus 2. That’s to be expected of course, and if the data density and other UX issues aren’t solved then I’ll stay on Mavericks, unfortunately.
In terms of long-run: I personally wouldn’t upgrade to OmniFocus 2 (despite being eligible in terms of my software license), since having poor data density is an productivity-shattering defect. It’s kind of like having your peripheral vision cut off completely, so that you have tunnel vision. Not exactly ideal.
In terms of defecting to another app – two issues with that.
I’ve just jumped ship to OmniGroup. I’ve always seen their software as overly expensive (now I see it as justified, of course) and relatively boring interface, from the old OS X Tiger days. So I didn’t really touch their software until early last year when I saw OmniFocus 2 with its modern interface.
I beta-tested OmniFocus 2, was pleasantly surprised. Fantastic. I also downloaded OmniPlan for iPad (sadly, the old version) and found that to be quite useful (despite its price).
Earlier in September, OmniGroup released a public beta of OmniOutliner 4. I tried it. Phenomenal note-taking capability. If combined with DEVONthink (as the data/knowledge repository), it is a killer combination (as compared to lesser workflows like Pages and Finder, Evernote and it’s built-in editor, …).
So yes.
Back to the topic.
Ideally I would not like to leave the OmniGroup ecosystem because 1) I’ve already joined it 2) OmniGroup is a respected software development company with a long history from the NeXT days.
There is no other alternative in the market at the moment. Cultured Code’s Things has a phenomenally slow development cycle (like OmniGroup and DEVONtechnologies), but without the history or an additional suite of products. It could just go the way of the Hit List, which vanished after the iOS App Store/Mac App Store era struck.
I trust OmniGroup to stay in business for a long time as its history has shown, and the profits that OmniGroup makes in its niche should be relatively significant as well.
I look forward to seeing OmniFocus on the iWatch and the iEye in the near future.
To conclude: I have no idea what to do. I think thinking about leaving OmniFocus for good at this point is a bit too premature. But if OmniGroup ignored all our proposals and objections, then as a user I’d be sorely disappointed.
Yes, design visions should be followed, but on the other hand, see all the ‘backtracking’ with iWork 5 from Apple, who historically ignores all its users.
Legitimate concerns about UX, usability, workflows and efficiency is legitimate, whether it comes from the majority of the users or the passionate minority.
One word on switching: Although the interfaces of contenders like THL and Things are really promising, each and every time I have tried to adapt one of those systems I totally lost track of my follow-up:
OF is the only one providing You with a comprehensive view of the future with the forecast view
OF is the only one providing a convenient reviewing system that assists You by being able to adapt review cycles for individual projects, thereby removing the hassle to review everything
These two feature receive their due attention in the new build and are absolute dealmakers in my eyes, especially for more complex databases…
@Dale, I can tell you that I have been looking for the ideal GTD solution which “checks all the boxes” literally for years now. There have been many promising options which have petered out to a state of non-development (or very slow development). Task Management - and especially that which attempts to support/incorporate GTD principles, is tough to develop, and even tougher to find something which one likes (at least that has been my experience).
I’ve tried and liked (to varying degrees) Remember The Milk, Toodledo, Nirvana, Zendone, The Secret Weapon (Evernote), OneNote, Todoist, Things, The Hit List and Omnifocus. Each - and I do include OF1 - has been (from my perspective) deeply flawed in some way. OF2 is the first GTD application since I first discovered The Hit List which a) impresses; b) encourages me; c) (despite some UI gaps) “flows” well and d) really does check all of the boxes (or at least most of them).
I’ve worked on a list of requirements for a long time and I’ve continued to make changes to my workflow and look for the best application for my purposes (as I’ve searched, I’ve relied primarily on Outlook, which handles my workflow reasonably well - but doesn’t really meet my needs - and so I’ve never stopped looking).
So here are my personal requirements and how OF2 stacks up (OF experts, please feel free to jump in if you disagree or want to expand on my conclusions):
MUST have:
Email to Task - OF2 supports this in several ways
Saved searches, Smart Lists, Perspectives - But of course OF2 supports this
Sub-tasks and sub-folders - OF2 supports folders, nesting of folders, task groups and projects - another YES
Alternative to the above - hierarchies - AOR, Projects (as folders), Tasks, Sub-tasks - As mentioned above, folders can be used for AOR (Areas of Responsibility) in OF2
Next Actions (Sequential and Parallel) - OF2 supports this, I still need to figure out the best views, but it is there
Note: Support Custom Views displaying the Next Action only - I think yes… I still need to build good perspectives for my use. I haven’t built this into my workflow yet, but I think it can be supported.
Reporting (or printing of custom filters or views) - filtering is there and printing is as well. OF2 earns another YES.
“Friendly”Evernote links - YES, OF2 displays links to EN notes in a “friendly” manner.
Versatile contexts or tags - contexts are there and tags can be supported. I am not using them much yet, but I will be adding them - this is another YES for OF2 (thanks to perspectives and the search filter)
Preferred - multiple tags / contexts per task - Yes to tags (although they must be free-form, no to contexts) - I am fine with the way OF2 handles this.
REALLY NICE to have:
Email to task - adding to existing task (through common subject name) - No - I have only seen this in service request management tools, such as HelpSTAR or SalesForce. It would be SO COOL if OF2 supported
this, but it does not. Nor does any other GTD app that I know of…
Review - YES - and nicely done, too!
Full-blown Evernote integration to use for reference - Nope (few have this, RTM, Nozbe and Zendone do it fairly well)
Alternative - full-blown Reference section (per project, quickly assigned in processing) - with support for “friendly” Evernote links - No again, OF has never really attempted to incorporate reference in the tool - and again, few have this (other than the tools which integrate with Evernote)
Start date (along with Due date) - OF2 supports this, another YES
Tickler feature (quick assignment in processing) Supported through the defer date, so OF2 earns a YES
Someday/Maybe Single task list (per project - quick assignment in processing) - through the use of Hold, this is a YES for OF2
Waiting For Single task list (per project - quick assignment in processing) In OF2, this can be supported through a context and incorporated into a single task list or through a perspective - I say YES, it is there.
Multi-task merge (into single task) - YES, OF2 has this through grouping
Single task decomposition (into many tasks) - No, I have not found an easy way to do this. Is it there?
Checkboxes in a task - No, I have not found an easy way to do this. Is it there?
Nice to have:
Calendar integration - YES, OF2 has this.
Recurring tasks - YES, OF2 has this also.
Timer - Nope, does anyone other than THL have this?
So to sum this up, one could always keep looking, but speaking from my personal experience and perspective, I have not found an application which covers so many of my needs to date. OF has always been powerful. For myself, I did not find OF1 particularly accessible (I do recognize that many did and that many loved - and still love - OF1) - and it took the release of OF2 to get me from a rocky relationship with OF to a solid marriage. :)
I hope Omni will not take all of this to indicate am fully content. I have some issues with the UI still, I think there is a lot of room for improvement in processing, I absolutely have feature suggestions I will make and hope to get consideration for, OF2 is not perfect. But as of today, I do think it is better than any other option available on any platform.
One final point. I am not sure that I agree that Omni will immediately stop supporting OF1. Would they abandon a base of users who have not adopted Mavericks yet? I think at the very least they will continue maintenance updates. Once all the suite is on a new data model, then I guess they will have some interesting decisions to make.
We want everyone to use the tool that’s best for them. Obviously, we hope that tool is OmniFocus, but if another app fits you better, we don’t want to try to trick you into staying here.
I’m disappointed to hear you feel ignored. If you could hang out by our coffee machine for a few days, you would know we have not ignored this conversation. But as I’ve mentioned elsewhere, the app is already very useful for many people.
There isn’t enough time to do this right (and still meet our June ship date), so we’ll ship with the status circles on the right. Then, when we have breathing room to design well, we intend to go back and think about how to allow one person to have their status circles on the left, someone else to have their single row layout, and the people who are already happy to keep the layout we’ve already crafted.
If I was running the ship at OmniGroup I wouldn’t either. It’d be a tremendously unproductive affair, and as Ken had posted (in the old OmniGroup forum), OmniGroup has had quite a good record of supporting and updating apps for many years.
There definitely is no trickery here. OmniGroup’s definitely not in the wrong in anyway here. We’re having rational (perhaps slightly too passionate) discussions about the current state of OmniFocus 2 at the present moment, with the possibility of moving to different solutions. As I said before I’m not entertaining the idea of doing so, as 1) I’m entrenched in the ecosystem 2) There’s no other (good) solution).
Despite what might sound like a rant (I’ve seen a few of my posts had their titles change with slightly emotive wording to more neutral wording) across the several topics that have spawned from the data density one, there’s a tremendous amount of goodwill towards OmniGroup (at least this is what I perceive having seen some of the discussions on both this Discourse forum and Twitter).
*Note: Interface update coming soon in Tinderbox 6.
There’s a general move towards a more minimalist design language, sparked by iOS 7 (to a lesser extent, the ‘Modern UI’ (previously known as Metro) in Windows 8/Windows Phone 7), which is both good and bad. I personally love minimalism, but having embraced highly functional tools in the past few years, having reduced functionality due to design changes is something undesirable. (Spotify is one example of reduced functionality… 50% of the items that would previously display on the screen is now off of the screen.)
I have no doubt that OmniFocus is useful for people – after all I mentioned that one of the best parts about OmniFocus (1) and the other OmniGroup apps is that it’s extensible.
OmniGroup has historically been very focused on the former, namely high functionality for the productivity workflow niche. I am definitely sure reduction and dumbing down is not a definite aim for OmniGroup and the many UX, usability, workflow and data density concerns will be addressed in the long-run.
It definitely is understandable that, with the shipping date for June coming up (I suspect it’s in anticipation of OS X 11/10.11, with the hope that it’ll get featured in the Mac App Store when the new OS is announced), that these features are unable to be added in at that time.
As Ken has said, OmniFocus 2 has a long life ahead (with major/minor adjustments through updates), which these considerations can be taken into account of.
Thanks for the response and the clarification, and for telling us that these are issues that are taken intoconsideration. It’s fantastic to know that our concerns about UX and usability is taken into account of when designing OmniFocus 2.
Until then, I’m probably going to stick with OmniFocus (1) as my daily driver, and probably will continue to do so even after OmniFocus 2 is released, and readily await the day that these changes are addressed or considered.
First, I am not defecting from OmniFocus nor advocating that anyone should do so. I am evaluating my options based on current offerings of solutions at my disposal. OF1 is leaving, if not now it will in the near future and I have a decision to make. I am planning my future actions accordingly by evaluating my options in an attempt to maintain the productivity I have using OF1. This is a determination each user makes on their own to arrive at a solution which results (hopefully) in identifying their most trusted tool to be productive. For this, I need to consider alternatives to OmniFocus as I already understand what OF1 does and am presently learning what OF2 can do.
Second, I appreciate your response and I believe I correctly understand your view. I wish to express my view and am happy to hear your continued thoughts.
Your statement appears, in my opinion, to contradict itself with point one below as you both would not and have already upgraded to OF2.
Your point 1:
I would be interest in knowing where you jumped from and why.
I sympathize with the cost, both monetary and emotional, in switching to or from a software product in a market as important as many hold productivity to be. This is exactly why I am determined to review and evaluate all alternatives as I would rather narrow my options and execute a judgment from there rather than moving along with or switching to unsatisfying software due to an attachment over cost, either current or incurred from unjustified switching. Personally, because of my extended use with OF1 I would rather continue with OF2 if possible, but I must be honest with myself and address concerns in my workflows in how I use the software.
Your point 2:
I would contend there are always alternatives. The further distinction of how individuals apply value to such products would then be a unique classification rendering any such alternative as some degree of good or bad — a distinction of this nature is not for me to say except for the case of my personal workflows. I do admit OmniFocus has been an excellent solution for me over the last several years and I value Omni Group and their ecosystem, but to consider the additional suite of products against other productivity software would seem beyond the scope of this question. My point is simply there are alternatives and each of us can measure their value according to a custom implementation within our workflows. In so doing, it is beneficial to consider all alternatives to have a more informed perspective and support in a final decision appropriate to one’s needs.
I must also conclude I myself am still evaluating my options. I have much invested in OmniFocus and even though the current OF2 iteration presents doubt for me, I will evaluate the software fairly based on my needs and what is actionable at its official release instead of promised solutions. I have my real concerns with OF2 and I am attempting to learn about alternatives. I am not positive in which direction I should take — emotionally OF2 is causing too much frustration in dealing with my data structure. This does not necessitate any software is generally better or worse, just that I have to address why and what it is about OF2 is causing friction in my workflow. Just as other products did not work in your case and you have now found reason to use OmniFocus for your own personal solution, I too am investigating my options to better select the best solution for my needs moving forward. Thank you for your explanation.
You have presented an interesting list. I have read through it and I am not sure how to respond as many of the items vary in importance within my personal workflows. This is not to say I consider your reasons to stay with OmniFocus to have no value. I just understand each user places value on the features which best compliment their workflow and this is difficult to quantify universally as such a tool (OmniFocus) can be used in countless scenarios with multiple methodologies.
To give a little background; the point I had originally asked about in another thread was "are there any contingency plans you have for when the ‘OF1 is no longer supported’ comment comes into fruition? " Intending to gather alternative solutions to OmniFocus; software or otherwise. The, now, beginning of this thread is a follow up question I had in response to a comment from that original question regarding major factors in OF2 being increasingly frustrating. I was curious if the commenter would continue using a software which they stated made them frustrated.
In my experience, I am presently finding the workflows I have become accustomed to while using OF1 not transferring to OF2 as precisely as I would have expected. I personally see this being associated to the design changes and their resulting modification to the application’s functionality. It is disheartening the software “change” was to a degree which makes me feel it has left out the flexibility I enjoy in OF1. I have no problem using scripting to craft solutions for my needs and I rely heavily on custom perspectives in OF1. I have crafted new scripts for Things in my testing and am reworking how I could use flat list opposed to nested. I also am considering if I stay with OF2 to update an Alfred workflow to replace the new built-in quick open feature of OF2; and I suppose I will also consider updating the Rob Trew scripts I find useful.
Right now I have a short list for consideration in no particular order after the first item:
OmniFocus 2
Things 2 (I know Things 3 is in alpha)
Evernote
Checkmark 2
OmniPlan
Notebook, Reminders & Calendar
Byword & Editorial
Moleskine Notebook & Pen
Personal Assistant, Mind Reader, or Psychic
Still gathering alternatives…
I have yet to find a way to express clearly what the missing piece is in my personal workflow on OF2 compared to OF1. Until then I plan to consider my options while further testing each iteration of OF2 so I may make a more complete decision on how I will proceed in the future once OF1 is no longer supported. To this end, I still am curious about alternative solutions to OmniFocus rather than a list of what OmniFocus does, but I do appreciate the work you did in compiling your reasons to stay with OmniFocus.
Let me add a few comments to some items from your list here:
Multiple contexts / tags per task — Multiple tags are not currently supported in any version of OmniFocus that I am aware of. I do not use tags and I maintain single contexts for my tasks, but I would argue appending @tag_name to the note field is not an ideal solution; rather it is a walk around. It should be noted: because of a change in the title for a popular thread in the old forums where users were asking for tags (multiple contexts) to be added to OmniFocus brought hope for such a change, but I cannot suggest anything more than an assumption here. This is still not a feature for OF2 as I understand.
Email to task — appending to a current task could be accomplished using custom scripting, but is not a feature of OmniFocus. OminFocus Mail Drop will not do this, but I would look at the AppleScript OF1 uses as a rule to import items as a starting point for creating such a custom script. The updates to the OmniFocus AppleScript library should also be considered here before porting the script from OF1 to OF2.
Single task decomposition (into many tasks) — I am not sure what exactly you mean here, but a copied list of items (say from the notes field) can be pasted into OmniFocus. They appear as separate tasks and this has been possible since OF1. You might need to clarify what defines “decomposition” for you in this case.
Checkboxes in a task — This sounds like a task which could be structured into a set of subtasks and is possible in OF1/OF2. You could also copy and paste a list from the note field in a task and create a group of subtasks similar to what I stated in the item above.
I would be interest in knowing where you jumped from and why.
I sympathize with the cost, both monetary and emotional, in switching to or from a software product in a market as important as many hold productivity to be. This is exactly why I am determined to review and evaluate all alternatives as I would rather narrow my options and execute a judgment from there rather than moving along with or switching to unsatisfying software due to an attachment over cost, either current or incurred from unjustified switching. Personally, because of my extended use with OF1 I would rather continue with OF2 if possible, but I must be honest with myself and address concerns in my workflows in how I use the software.
Your point 2:
I would contend there are always alternatives. The further distinction of how individuals apply value to such products would then be a unique classification rendering any such alternative as some degree of good or bad — a distinction of this nature is not for me to say except for the case of my personal workflows. I do admit OmniFocus has been an excellent solution for me over the last several years and I value Omni Group and their ecosystem, but to consider the additional suite of products against other productivity software would seem beyond the scope of this question. My point is simply there are alternatives and each of us can measure their value according to a custom implementation within our workflows. In so doing, it is beneficial to consider all alternatives to have a more informed perspective and support in a final decision appropriate to one’s needs.
I must also conclude I myself am still evaluating my options. I have much invested in OmniFocus and even though the current OF2 iteration presents doubt for me, I will evaluate the software fairly based on my needs and what is actionable at its official release instead of promised solutions. I have my real concerns with OF2 and I am attempting to learn about alternatives. I am not positive in which direction I should take — emotionally OF2 is causing too much frustration in dealing with my data structure. This does not necessitate any software is generally better or worse, just that I have to address why and what it is about OF2 is causing friction in my workflow. Just as other products did not work in your case and you have now found reason to use OmniFocus for your own personal solution, I too am investigating my options to better select the best solution for my needs moving forward. Thank you for your explanation.
[/quote]
Point 1: (Not a) Contradictory Statement
It doesn’t contradict itself.
My software license for OmniFocus 1 was purchased at the eligible upgrade date. Hence my OmniFocus 1 entitles me to an OmniFocus 2 license due to that.
This means that I can use both OmniFocus 1 and OmniFocus 2 when it comes out.
However, as I said before, poor data density will lead me to continue to use OmniFocus 1, despite being able to use OmniFocus 2 by virtue of the eligible update purchase date.
Point 2: Customer loyalty to OmniGroup
I have several reasons as to why I hold this position.
OmniGroup as a company
–i) OmniGroup has a long history for building productivity apps for the Apple ecosystem (since NeXT).
–ii) They are dedicated towards building apps, as opposed to other examples. I am confident that I can invest my time and money without the company just spontaneously disappear, be acquired, or go public for the sake of ‘cashing out’.
–iii) I like the culture and public image of OmniGroup. They seem passionate about productivity, which is fantastic.
Time and financial investment.
–i) I bought the app already, and have invested a considerable amount of money into the OmniGroup ecosystem (for good reason).
–ii) I like building workflows around productivity utilise that I use. Creating workflows take time and relative experience with the productivity app. You can’t build a coherent workflow and stick with it if you’re constantly hopping about.
–iii) I am concerned about wasting time trying to shop around other app developers’ ecosystems (such as Things or Wunderlist), which only provide partial solutions, whereas OmniGroup’s portfolio is relatively big. I use OmniFocus and OmniOutliner 4 on a daily basis.
No other competing alternative that is as good as OmniGroup’s offerings. (Part of your point 3, ‘always alternatives’ argument that I’ll address here).
–i) Yes, there are always alternatives. It’s just that they’re not good enough (‘good’ being subjective. See above reasons for sticking with OmniGroup as a whole).
Yes, if things go badly and none of our concerns are addressed, then yes, the short-term plan would be to continue to use OmniFocus (and to forego upgrading to the next version of OS X if compatibility issues occur with OF1 and OS X 11/10.11) while the long-term plan would be, yes, abandoning OmniFocus in favour of another app.
However, this isn’t the most ideal solution, and as Lizard has posted, these are considerations that they’re taking into account, to which I also replied to.
If it doesn’t, however, yes, long-term plan is to leave. Not exactly ideal though.
Thanks for the notice about Things 3. Definitely going to keep an eye out for that.
I’m not exclusive to OmniGroup’s ecosystem (Much like how I was interested in Sketch 3 (which competes against OmniGraffle 5(?)), but for the reasons above, I prefer to stick within it.
Item 3 on the list isn’t ideal (Evernote) as Evernote’s not really a productivity company – it’s more of a 'get big and rich by IPO and catering to everyone sort of company. I used to use Evernote but I stopped using it (went to use DEVONthink Pro Office instead. Took some time to adjust but it’s fantastic).
Checkmark 2’s… not for OS X. OmniPlan, on the other hand – not really a task manager. More of a Gantt Chart/project management sort of thing. Item 6 – fragmenting your stuff here. 7 – Odd. I’ve heard of people using text-based workflows (especially using Markdown or plaintext) but in my opinion it’s quite bad, as I prefer to have my software do all the visualisation for me. 8 – hardly a consideration… same issue as my objection to 7.
I think 9 would be hilarious. Would your psychic use OmniFocus 2? ;)
I do not want to debate on your point one as I said that it appears, in my opinion, to be the case. You say otherwise and I am wrong, ok. Can I ask where you jump from before starting to use OmniFocus? This could be informative.
Point 2:
I am sure you would agree different users have different opinions on what is a “good” alternative for their particular workflows. Your opinion is that OF2 is the best for your particular scenario even though you have stated reservations if concerns are not addressed and have planned continued use of OF1 upon such happenings. This is why I asked the original question and begin my development of a contingency plan to find an alternative in case concerns I or maybe other users have are in fact not addressed. Further down you thank me for mentioning Things 3. Such communication of information is what I had hoped this question would deliver for everyone, not a debate over the reasons someone considers a solution better than another.
There’s no confusion here, nor are there contradictions. It clearly isn’t the case. I’ll break it down if my original statement was unclear.
What I said: I personally wouldn’t upgrade to OmniFocus 2 (despite being eligible in terms of my software license), since having poor data density is an productivity-shattering defect.
Element 1: I have an OmniFocus 1 license.
Element 2: My OmniFocus 1 license is eligible for an upgrade to OmniFocus 2.
Element 3: I can choose to upgrade to OmniFocus 2 free of charge due to the eligible purchase.
Element 4: However, I will not do so, due to my concerns about data density, …
No contradictions here.
I purchased the OmniFocus 1 license to use OmniFocus 1, and I get the option to upgrade for free.
Having the mere option to upgrade for free (due to purchasing a license within the allotted time) is different to buying a license separately for OmniFocus 2, and not using it. That would be a contradictory action, but in my case there is no contradiction.
Addressing point 1:
Going back to what I used to use:
I used RTM for half a decade (a bit of TeuxDeux when it was free), as well as formatted tables in Pages that are printed.
I also used Moleskine as well, but I’ve moved that portion of the workflow to another section in OmniFocus.
Addressing point 2: Yes: ‘I am sure you would agree different users have different opinions on what is a “good” alternative for their particular workflows.’ Yes: ‘Your opinion is that OF2 is the best for your particular scenario even though you have stated reservations if concerns are not addressed and have planned continued use of OF1 upon such happenings.’ Hm: ‘… not a debate over the reasons someone considers a solution better than another.’
Right. I was under the impression that this was a debate, about discussing potential movement to a different solution.
My post was moved here and I get updates according to my original post rather than the new implied concept of this thread and title. In response to the debate of potentially moving away from OmniFoucs I present this. If OF2 does not meet a user’s requirements, then information should be collected to make an informed decision about next actions. This, I expect, should involve alternatives to the software as one might want to consider all facts in choosing future commitments and direction.
I reserve my final decision to be made after (1) Omni Group officially releases OF2 and I can measure features present in the software and not promised solutions of future updates, (2) I look towards other alternatives to give my decision perspective with regards to what options are available to me currently, and (3) measuring the requirements I find important and determining which solution meets them in a manner promoting beneficial productivity in my personal workflow.
Again, I do not wish to continue in debates of “better” software, features, or scenarios — only to gather information on alternatives. Determination of their value is per user workflow. The title of this new thread suggests three potential answers; yes, no, or undecided. For now I am undecided.
If you wish to continue discussing point one let’s move this to a private discussion as it does not add to the thread here. If you are interested I can offer my reasons why I concluded what I did regarding a contradiction. I can decide then if I want to further engage beyond my statement of “ok” in agreement to your claim in my being wrong concerning the nature of how I understood your post. I am ok with having misunderstood you and I will be ok no matter what you conclude. For the current setting, however, I do not see value in responding any further in this thread regarding that topic.
This thread has been quiet for a couple of months. It would really be encouraging to hear somebody from Omnigroup say that they are still working on these deal-breaker interface problems.
